Brazzil Magazine - A Danger in Brazil: Splitting into Two Races

Hidden behind accounts in the press and the government's Diário Oficial, the real Brazil is being built. The country is on the road towards an ever more participatory, responsible democracy.

The economy is growing, and in a short time we will be competitive in high-tech industries; agriculture is turning us into a world granary, tourism will contribute increasingly to the national revenue.

But it will be difficult for our per-capita income to meet that of the First World countries, or that of the new rich that form a New Second World.

Brazil will continue as the champion of income concentration. We are not undergoing a tragedy like Africa's, but neither are we distributing income in a rational, sustainable manner.

Education—the only instrument capable of changing the income distribution pattern—will show improvement in the number of students enrolled, the number completing high school, the number of college-admission candidates.

But those improvements are insufficient to reduce the distance between rich and poor, or the growing gap between our education level and that of countries making a serious investment in educating their people.

By maintaining the present course, we will not be exporters of science and technology, except for isolated sectors; we will not be great producers of art; nor will we win more Olympic medals.

Healthcare will certainly undergo improvements in quality and universalization of delivery, but housing conditions will not make great progress. The cities, above all, tend towards urban chaos, and crime—both organized and petty— is becoming uncontrollable.

Surprisingly, two sectors are advancing and give signs of growth: solidarity and organizing. The last few years have shown an increase in the organization of society and in socially responsible actions on the part of the wealthiest Brazilians.

But social responsibility does not necessarily evolve from mere assistance into transformation. And the social organizing can increase corporativism, each group fighting for its own interests and ignoring—even tearing—the social fabric.

Despite this greater organizing and solidarity, the growing distance between the extremes can be foreseen: the 10% richest, families with an average monthly salary of 5,600 reais (US$ 1982), and the 50% poorest, families that receive an average of 272 reais (US $96) a month.

Even graver, is the growing distance in access to, and quality of essential services according to social class.

If urgent changes are not made, that will be the most serious tendency for the future: an inequality so great that it will consolidate the rupture of the Brazilian species into two groups that will not recognize each other.

More than unequal, they will be distinct; they will form different races in culture and in interests.

This tendency has been evident for years, and for years we have insisted in maintaining that course, despite the illusion of the political rituals, the economic data, and the timid advances in education and healthcare.

But even if we are ever more distant from the countries forming the New Second World, we have the resources to reorient our destiny and all the conditions are present to do so.

We will not catch up to the countries that changed course in the twentieth century, but we can reorient our own twenty-first century.

It is a shame that the superficiality of politics impedes us from making the change that Brazil needs. Despite his pledge and the hope that it inspired in us, in August the President of the Republic vetoed a modest Social Shock contained in the federal budget for 2005.

He refused to indicate a new course, leaving us tragic projections as to where we are going and weighed down by pessimism about the reality they seem to portend.

Canadas pride
written by Guest, 2005-02-25 22:57:21

I keep hearing about how bad Africa has become, and about the ravages it has suffered at the hands of European colonialism. "This in large part, is not true".countries like Ghana and Nigeria have never been ravaged by european colonialism, but rather, meary tainted by the european presence. I can't get over the they way many Brazilians(with their incidiously racist views) just love to compares their country with the African contenent.I think that this so called "African tragety" which is so widely perpetuated in your country, Is no more than a myth up held by wishful thinking Bralizians to make them selfs feel better about their own countries short comings. The truth is , "AFRICA IS A CONTINENT AND NOT A COUNTRY". For Brazilians to compare their country with the African continent is not only rediculse, but proposterously misleading;" START COMPARING AFRICA WITH SOUTH AMERICA, AND THEN SPEAK". " BRAZILIANS JUST LOVE THEIR EUROPEAN HERITAGE" so much so that they tend to forget exactly which part of Europe they came from.Portugaul is not exactly a world power in modern times. In fact Portugaul happens to be the poorest country in all of Europe,even more so than countries like Yugoslavia and Croatia. Even when Portugaul was a wealthy power, the country was still a racially mixed society,because of it's African Moore and middle eastern Arab conqouerers. Being from Canada, the whole notion of Brazil being a racially divided country almost seems laughable. A year ago I didn't even know Brazil was a country of diffrent races, just dark Brazilian and Light Brazilians,with very little distinction between the two. Now I'm starting hear that Hispanic Brazilians regard themselves as beeing better than Black Brazilians, which was surpiseing. I understand that the slave trade may have alot to do with this. I also know that the majority of Brazilians- both black and white- are poorly educated and know little or nothing about slavery and it's place in human society,both in acieant times, and recent times. Beleave it or not whites at time were a primary source of slaves for the world.In fact, the very word slave is a derivitive of the word slav.The slavic people are a white race of men in eastern europe,(Poles,Russians,czechs,lithuainians,croations,Yu ogo Slavs, Slavakians ect.) used to be sold in the middle east ,north and central Africa, and at time even as far south as West Africa. Middle eastern peoples such as the Persians and Turks were also used as slaves at a time, by Islamic and Mongolian traders. They to were also traded in Africa as far as Ghana and Nigeria by slave trading Arabs. I'm also sure that the Portugese, were also used as slaves by their Moore and Arab conquorers. Dispite what hispanics in brazil think about Blacks, they are not a bastardised people from a Ravged continent; but rather the victems of greedy African Kings with no problem selling the people of other tribes in to bondage. The vikings used to do the very same thing. In other words "IT IS NOT THEIR FAULT, AND THEY SHOULD NOT BE TREATED AS THOUGH IT WERE"

Canada\'s Pride
written by Guest, 2005-02-26 01:26:20

I wouldn't be surprised if this growing rift between social classes in Brazil eventually lead to civil war. This is usually how they start.Take Russian Communism and the fall of the aristicrocy , as well as the rise of communism in Cuba, and the fall of colonialism in Santo Dimingo; all began this way. Brazilians need to learn to become more and more uncomfortable with the countries social policies, because this may prevent potential conflict in the future. Hundras,El salvdor, Venezuela,Chili,Cuba, and if step aren't taken, Brazil will also be added to the list
Keep in mind, I am only twenty years old ,but even I have enough for sight site to see the implications of a socialially segragated country with such a large black and mulatto population. It is potentially dangerous, not to mention unfair. check out www.brazzil.com/content/veiw/8918/ 76/ and keep an eye out for Canadian guy.

Nothern view
written by Guest, 2005-03-03 09:40:17

First, your bashing on Portugal and portuguese was unnecessary. I'm not a fan of Portugal mylsef, but you'll not make yourself heard by bashing people.

Second, I garantee that portuguese are just as white, as xenophobe and as racist as any other people in Europe. This of a "mixed" society is crap, and as far I know, there's something called "The reconquest" from the Iberic peninsula occupied territories in the past, where the Moors were kicked off big time, in the "spanish-style kill kill kill" (also applied with american natives).

Third, living in this country all my life I'm sure that any hard working black, studying hard and strugling all his life, will do well in life.

black do not equal poor
mulatto do not equal poor

Fourth, "Hispanic" Brasilians (from Latin Hispania - Spain). This ridiculous american term used for segregating the toilet clearners mexicans from the rest of the people cannot be applied here. Or else you'd need to say Luso-brasilians (from Portugal, from latin Lusitania), germanic-brasilians (from German, from latin Germania), italic-brasilians (from Italy, from latin Italia), afro-brasilians (from Africa) and so on.

Fifth, yes I do have black ancestors and Indians besides whites and I tell you this, those who work, study, and fight all life do well, those that prefer to drink everyday, chase woman, or are just plain vagabonds are underachievers.

This "fairness" crap makes me sick to my stomack.

A 20year old Canadian guy
written by Guest, 2005-03-12 09:19:07

Dispite weather the Moor & Arabs were eventually booted from the Ibean Countries of Europe doens't change the fact the they ruled over that part of Europe for EIGHT HUNDREDEi YEARS. If it wasen't for French savages,chances are that part of europe would still under their rule. I Am from Cananda, and let me tell you, if I came across a Brizilian of Portugese decent I would be able to tell in a instant; in this country I am regarded as being non white as would you be.That doesn't necissarially imply anything negitve, in fact in this country it is rather refreshing, But I still can not get over how much you Brazilian love to ragard youself as being white, espesically you "Northern view". I am a peace loving individual, and I am not looking to offend you in anyway, but you are the perfect example of what I mean. You are mixed, Not white, and I cannot understand why you do not just say so, insted of dancing around the subject." Kill kill kill"(kkk) seems to me to just be your way of denieing what you truly are, and that is not White,; the KKK in the U.S. Would also be looking to kill kill kill you, my friend. I beleave you and all other non white Brazilians who go out of their way to pose as whites, are nothing more than pathetic "WANNA BES". Latin Germania? what the f**k are you talking about? you sound like nothing more than a wishful thinking Brazilian to me.My question is why? I am a quarter Australian,and a quarter Russian, but I don't go around posing, I can not see any reason why I would want to. This fairness crap makes you sick? I would love to see you take a trip back in time to the old Southern united states as yourself, and then say that. You must really beleave you are White! I think it's kind of funny. Get a grip,insted of apposing your decent you should try and do what you can to help. I find it very repugnent to see people of European ancestry in the position they are in tody, espcially when recalling the backward and often revolting methods which they used to gain their power, I mean, A musket, desease and exceedingly low morals should not be enough to win anybody's respect. I am jsut so surprised at how people like you and so many other Brazilian love to deny themselves.

Europeans aren't exatly Xenophobic, North americans on the other hand are another story.Most Eoropean people I know have not been raised to regard race as anything in particular, Unlike Americans, And as I discover, Brazilians. I love European people, some of my closest friends are European, and let me tell you, they often dislike North Americans as much as I do or more( me,moderatly).They often will go out of their way to included me as one of them, before I correct them or set the record straight. If only more Brazlians would do the same, then maybe this artical would have never been written.

You should except that you are mixed and not white, you should also except that most Ibeabn Europeans(not all) are also of a mixed racial backround. If I can, I would like to qoute a white supermist that I have read, and I qoute(more or less)"Southern Europeans are no longer part of the White race, they have been "mongrelised" by years of rule by Black Moore And Brown Arabs". In fact even if you still consider yourself to be white, I would strongly suggest otherwise, because anywhere else in the world you will only be ridiculed for pretending. At the very least you are a mongrel, "there I said it". In the U.S. you are a n****r or a Spick (one or the other), in Canada, you are confused; to me, you are in denile. Mind you, I know alot more on the subject then most Candian's my age. In fact, my peers would be surprised to know that I could even write something like this, "but that is irrelevent".

20year old Canadian guy
written by Guest, 2005-03-13 03:02:53

Please, excuse the minor mistakes on my last post, it was written rather quickly.

seen the problem
written by Guest, 2005-04-07 10:22:04

The problem is the ill fated non recognition that the afro-Brasilieros have in Brasileiro society. The love of the European culture is romantic and very respectable, however, there is a problem when peoplpe are put into classes. The society puts the poor into one classand the rich into the other. It's not race against race, but the classification of Real signs and on those bills the faces are placed or not. It's very sad to see this and many and all the problems of the country are apparent because of this. The rich, light skinned, are the very insignificant minority that co0ntrl the entire population. The African heritage in this country is beautiful and the Brasileiro culture would not exist without it. If those Brasilian want a war, through separation, this is what they will get and the vital signs of this inevitable outcome are already in place. It's very sad to see the 10 percent controling the rest. And if Rich Brasilians think that this is the way, they had better think twice, because that throne will not be standing for long if you do not take care of your people, Black or White. This is also an oddity, even to think of, since Brasilians and so interconnected that finding color differentiations is like,choosing a group trees and trying to find differences in greens in order to classify which tree is actually a tree. Self-destructive is the Human condition and racial discrimination is one of the saddest methods of classification in history. Human beings are human beings no matter what color charts are made to define them.

Races in Brazil
written by Guest, 2005-04-14 01:53:29

I think it is no surprise to experience the idolation of the European origin by most 'lighter' brown people in Brazil.

Quoting 'Canadas Pride' above: "the majority of Brazilians- both black and white- are poorly educated and know little or nothing about slavery and it's place in human society,both in acieant times, and recent times."
The 'normal' people (middle- and lower class) complain about the corruption of the police and 'higher' class people. Witch i think is mostly justified.

But on the other hand, if you ask about the people who lived in South America before the 'colonisation' by (mostly) the Portugees they have only a faint idea about them.
In the north-east (this is the region i visit most) i did not come across a museum who displays anything more than a few old drawings of indians. On the other hand, everyone can say of the top of there head, the first Portugese captain who set food on Brazilian soil, where and when. Continuing with the next governors and so on.
When asking theire opinion about this, (most) Brazilians say that the people before the colonisation did not do anything with the country, thus, there is no problem with the extinctin of them...
When stating that, well lets face it, even today Brazil does not mean much viewing on the export of technology or other things it would then be alright that 'we' ( i am from Europe - Belgium ) do it again, and making them our new slaves; it would be no problem for them.
And that they are 'slaves' to the few percent rich people in Brazil.
I get no answer...

Mind you, i do not blame these people of thinking by that way. I am convinced that it is a lack of poor education!
Also, everything they see on tv regarding wealth and beauty ar all played by 'white' actors.

First of all people should be educated about the complete history of the country they live in, and the relationship with other countrys.
Mayby then they will have a more clearer view of the situation they live in and find a way how they can change it for the better.

As a European inhabitant, i think the beauty of Latin American people lies in the mixture of the races and cultures from the past. Not the lack teroff.
Pitty they sometimes forget this...

__just my 2 cents__

my ideas
written by Guest, 2005-05-11 16:19:08

\n This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it '>my ideas
hola me llamo deric "coogi" and i have this idea for a video game. based in SOUTH AMERICA. i really want to give this idea to any company that will take my idea. i dont want the money, but at least my name under the credits. please please somebody email me with any suggestions or companies that will take my idea. this idea will put SOUTH AMERICA in the spotlight up here in NORTH AMERICA. e mail me and we can do this. i dont want no money but my name under the credits. hasta luego.

to 20 year old Canadian guy!
written by Guest, 2005-05-24 00:11:37

You are such a narrow minded idiot! You live in Canada and if it wasn't for the U S A -your snow blown country would melt into the gulf! You are jus like alot of Brasilans,Eurpennises and a few Canadians.You want to blame all your problems on America.I live in Texas,as a 60 year old black man,I know about racisim first hand.It's gotten alot better in America for blacks,THE MAIN PEOPLE USING THE WORD n****r -ARE YOUNG BLACK RAPPERS,not white people.I travel all over the world with my job! I was never treaty worse then in several Canadian coutries,it reminded me of when I was in South Africa in the 1970's!I was also treaty very bad in Brasil and Columbia.I just don't blame the rest of the people of those countries,for the actions of a few,you watch American telivision and you think you know America! You know nothing,until you open your eyes and your mind!

It\'s all in the genes
written by Guest, 2005-05-27 11:04:14

If you're born with bad genes and crappy brain cells, you're doomed. It's how it works. Always have. Always will.
Look around you. Unfortunately not everyone is the same. If it were the case, everyone would be healty, well-off, rich, intelligent and decent.
It takes all kinds. Just look at yourself and live to your best potential, regardless of the color of your skin.
What you are is what you are.

It\'s all in the genes
written by Guest, 2005-05-27 11:04:19

If you're born with bad genes and crappy brain cells, you're doomed. It's how it works. Always have. Always will.
Look around you. Unfortunately not everyone is the same. If it were the case, everyone would be healthy, well-off, rich, intelligent and decent.
It takes all kinds. Just look at yourself and live to your best potential, regardless of the color of your skin.
What you are is what you are.

20year old Canadian guy
written by Guest, 2005-05-27 12:08:47

the problem here is that there is this idea that what americans regard as white equals white. which is completely wrong, there are more europeans than americans, and all europeans consider anyone and everyone in europe to be white i.e. caucasian, this goes from sweden, to greece to portugal. Somewhere down the line americans have further segregated the white race and considered only blonde and blue eyed northern europeans white. Skin colour is not a determinant of race. there are japanese who have whiter skin than some english for example. one must take alot more genetic determinants into play when considering what race a person is; like bone structure, nose shape etc.. Yes ofcourse there are alot of white brasilians, as far as i know nearly 50% of the population. there have been millions of people who have migrated from all over europe there and have not mixed within ethnic groups. are you saying therefore that as soon as they cross the atlantic they suddenly become mixed race? about south europeans being mongralised, that is absolutely ridiculous, just travel to any of these countries and see for yourself. bottom of the line is if you are to classify races which in itself is ridiculous, any peoples native of europe are caucasian/white ... to call iberians as not white cause they may have a darker tan is to classify red heads with freckles as another race aswell. ridiculous.

My View
written by Guest, 2005-05-31 02:00:53

The Brazilian people need to wake up and look at the real problem the wealthy minority controlling the majority

The Race Myth
written by Guest, 2005-06-15 22:26:48

Scientists are unable to classify people by race because
humans are all descended from the same African
stock. Skin color is not race. Every human is of
mixed origins or "race", as gene studies indicate.

Chip Korngiebel in Sitka, Alaska
written by Guest, 2005-06-27 00:12:56

Yes we have bigots and close minded people in the U.S. even up here in Alaska sorry to say. Just look at the our govenor and his Daughter. Its an axces of evil. You seem to miss the point of the artical. As a nation you don't care for those who for what ever reason can not care fore themselves. Allow them the right to a good education, Health care, a safe place to live. If we take from a father and or mother the right to care for thier family and themselves. When you take from a person any chance to truly succeed no matter how small. That person will say the hell with this and revolt. Have we become the people our parents warned us about.
I learned back in 1986 when was still in the Coast Guard just of the coast of Nicaragua. We are not a democracy and haven't been one for quite some time.
Heres a few quote's from the past. Which have been lost to greed.
" Fear to do ill,
and you need fear
Nought else"
Benjamin Franklin

" Observe good
faith and justice
toward all nations"
George Washingtons farwell speech

"I have sworn......
Hostility against ever
form of Tyranny
over the mind of man"
Women I might add
Thomas Jefferson

Last but not least
"Those who Deny
Freedom to others
Deserve it not
for themselves"
Abraham Lincoln
Sadly my goverment has lost respect for its selve and for its people.
Chip

PS Cananda the way you treat your women you haven't got much room to talk!

20year old canadian guy is an idiot
written by Guest, 2005-07-28 18:09:07

I think 20 year old Canadian guy takes the stance he does because it is so uncool to be classified as white that even many recent ethnic whites in North America no longer want to be considered as white. It has gotten so bad that I saw an article about race in a leading American magazine where they quoted a polish immigrant in high school who claimed she wasn't white but "polish". I'm sure Mr. Canada is just one of those want to be "original gangstas" of greek, or italian decent, who grew up on MTV and wants so bad to not be white because it is not considered cool. Race has always been subjective however I have found that in Canada it has always been stricter than in the supposedly strict USA. For example most people of italian decent in canada are not always considered white however in the US most people would say italian is white. In addition I know many people in the US who have indian blood who are considered white. In fact sorry to dissapoint mr. canada but I actually know southerners who are white who have indian ancestory and who's grandparents unfortunantely were in the KKK. In addition learn something about a Brazil before you start telling them what they are and are not. Brazil has a ton of people of german decent that is why the guy made the comment about germanic brazilians. Not all brazilians of europeans decent came from portugal in fact many are decendents of Russians, switzerland , finland and even some english and french. I know it is hard for someone as stupid as you to grasp this, but North America was not the only place europeans wanted to immigrate to. The division of wealth between North America and South America 50 years ago was not near as big as it is know. Take a south american history and economics classe buddy and learn to think a little more before shooting your mouth off as if you were some kind of authority. And remember, it's not so bad being white. Now go back to chillin with your homies.

Canadian Guy you are one ignorant f**k!
written by Guest, 2005-08-21 11:09:45

You know the comment about Hispanic Brasilians, I just want to understand the comment about Mexican Toilet Cleaners. That to me was very offensive being Mexican American myself, comments like these really says alot about your knowledge and mentality you ignorant bastard.

Brasil is that bad!
written by Guest, 2005-09-07 11:42:14

I am a black american going to brasil and you all are saying brasil is a real racist place. I am shocked it hought it was laid back.
Help me out on this?

moving to brazil
written by Guest, 2005-09-13 06:51:56

I am black british and visiting brazil in oct. Northeast. I am very concerned by some of the comments made in terms of racisim.
I visited in May of this year and expected some hostility but experienced none,just happy laid back people.
do your comments about racisim pertain to certain areas . I was considering staying with my children for 4months.

Ignorant people
written by Guest, 2005-09-18 22:27:49

We are not talking about the hispanic or the black or the indian people of Brasil. I say that Brasil has German people, A LOT, Italian, Slavic, french as so blacks, indian and portugueses. And They are ALL part of the brasilian race. One more thing: we Were colonized by Portugal, but the racist people in Brasil That keep talking about an european heritage, are not talking about an portuguese heritage. Ask in the countryside of Rio Grande do Sul. Take this as you want. And learn more about Brasil before sayng s**t, speacially those north americans(NOT Canada And Mxico), that don't even study world Geography in school.

...
written by Guest, 2005-10-02 00:05:34

splitting the country into two races??? what about the Jews and seceret jews by chance don't they like to cloak and pit races against each other?? how about the highlander day school?? the bela Kun Jew controlled Hungary that predates hitler??? look at the media you will find more parrot noses there than in the Amazon!!

A danger of splitting
written by Guest, 2005-10-05 15:58:19

The indigenous peoples in Canada have embarked on a quest to form their own government. This is a result of great oppression and colonization, as well as casting them into reservations like animals. This has fuelled a bitter hatred for the British style of government in this country, which also threatens to split the country. Brazil on the other-hand ought not to do this to the natives, nor should the natives accept this limited lifestyle of being corralled like cattle. All of Brazil ought to belong to all the different peoples of Brazil that had a hand in settling it. To show any one group as an exclusive owner of any large tracts of land, whether be Indigenous, Europeans or even mega companies, divides the country and could potentially lead to great civil strife and the tearing apart of the country itself. This is against all integration of people which I understand that at least thirty percent of Brazil is Mullato. Let us not make the mistake of Canada and the White/Black US.

Brasil is that bad!/moving to brazil
written by Guest, 2005-10-27 15:27:08

Yes, Brazil is laid back. Brazilians have an admiralbly high level of social skills. This is what tourists experience and rave about. It was told that it is only as one adjusts to permanantly living there that the truth hits home. But 4 months should be a breeze (re:moving to brazil). Racism's everywhere. I'm black and love going to Brazil. I'd love to live there a while despite the harsh realities of life. One more note: the author of the article above is very short-sighted if he thinks "the rupture of the Brazilian species into two groups that will not recognize each other" is not already a centuries-old reality. There are anywhere from 700 to 1000 Quilombos(communities of decsendants of escaped ex-slaves which were independent and self-sustaining for decades during slavery) spread out all over Brazil, which are cut off from Brazilian society, invisible to most, like the "Untouchables/blacks" of racist India. Brazil has the highest population of Blacks in the world outside of the "country" of Nigeria! Two groups, unequal and distinct, exist already in Brazil and have for a long long time. Haves/Have nots. But it's not stopping me from my next trip in November!

a view of Brazil by a Black American
written by Guest, 2005-10-31 14:55:23

I've made a short trip to Brazil two yeras ago, i was appalled by the situation of Bkack people oveer there.During my stay there I've never seen a black person driving a car or eating at a restaurant as a matter of fact the black population of these two cities were completely invisible except at the outskirts as you enter the cities when you pass by delapidated houses, slums etc. My friends and I were really amazed at always being the only black faces at restaurants, malls (yes even malls!!!).
From what we've seen the population is very mixed, the average person you see in the streets is a combination of the different ethnicities that have come to this part of the world, however it seems that the wealth of the country is concentrated among the people of european descent, these are the ones you mostly see eating out at restaurants, frequenting night clubs, vacations hubs like Florianapolis.
We've had a good experience there, we were treated with respect and we never felt in any ways ill regarded because we were black. In any case we came back to the US with the idea that the Black Brazilians are completely marginalized and we got an added appreciation of how far the US has gone in terms of race relations and the overall improvement of its Black population.

re: a black america
written by Guest, 2005-11-06 12:50:21

good comment. As a white american who has lived in brazil for the past 3 years(both in the predominantely white south and the predominantely black and mixed state of bahia in the northeast), I've often wondered how black americans veiwed brazil, when they visited. What you said above is very true, you do only see white people, for the most part in positions of power and wealth. The one thing I would add though is that although this is true, brazilians on average whether black or white are in general much more comfortable with each other than your average american. I think that has to do with the fact that although you do have black and white you also have a huge ground of mixed people in the middle, which serves to connect the black and white populations in a way. Although there are distinct elements to black brazilian and white brazilian culture, they are much more mixed than in the US and this, I believe softens the racism some. Although I would never say it doesn't exist.

re: a view by a black american
written by Guest, 2005-11-06 15:41:24

Earlier a commentor from a current European expressed that one should know the history of the country. He is correct as in the first response to this title. The U.S. was founded by white Europeans that put "all men are equal" in the preamble to the declaration of independence. Then the country was hijacked and "whiteness" was mandated once France helped the U.S. Government to be formed. They switched up after winning the Revolutionary War. By contrast Brazil got its beginnings from King Joao IV of Portugal, Algarve and the annexed Brazil whose son refused to return to Portugal after Nepolean's war machine collapsed thus started the process of the state of Brazil. King Joao IV although a King in Europe was not of original European descent thus the two countries were founded on dipolar foundations. One based on white supremacy (the U.S.) the other based on having been founded by people who did not have the "white purity" mindset that plagues the U.S. There's a lot more to the story of course but I tried to give the gist of why I think racial hostilities are greater in the U.S. than in Brazil. The U.S. mandated skin color games and hostilities as a part of the fabric of the U.S. Simply go to the Library of Congress U.S. and read the speeches of the so-called leaders and read the evil insanity for yourself before going into denial about how the U.S. became so skin-color evil.

re: re: a view by a black american
written by Guest, 2005-11-06 16:45:30

In addition, many whites (not all) want to mandate who the Brazilian people are. They want to somehow spread the "let's play the U.S. white game in Brazil" game. Having Brazilians talking as they do. Acting as they do. White supremisist radio stations in Brazil, white supremisist rallies in Brazil and white supremisists staulking the bars, schools and neighborhoods in Brazil looking for recruits. Make no mistake. The fantasy of racist white U.S. is to somehow figure out a way to get the Neo-nazi game across Brazil. Listen for the signs of neo-nazi propaganda in your country and stamp it out now. Otherwise it will be a repeat of the U.S. historic past.

Guy from Norway
written by Guest, 2005-11-12 08:53:36

Don`t adapt this color sickness from us Europeans and Americans. I always wanted to go to Brazil for it`s diversity. You are my distant love:-) Evolve on your own terms. Forget the stupid notion of beeing white as it should have anything to do with brain capasity! It don`t. We invented racisim and started two world wars....

CANADIAN IGNORANCE
written by Guest, 2005-11-20 06:22:57

Hi,

I am a Chilean that lived in Canada as a legal immigrant years ago . I went back to my country because my family could not stand canadian racism !

I read this oppinion posted by a Canadian and I really got upset:

"Dispite weather the Moor & Arabs were eventually booted from the Ibean Countries of Europe doens't change the fact the they ruled over that part of Europe for EIGHT HUNDREDEi YEARS. If it wasen't for French savages,chances are that part of europe would still under their rule. I Am from Cananda, and let me tell you, if I came across a Brizilian of Portugese decent I would be able to tell in a instant"

This guy does not know what he is talking about. Portugueses are part of the Mediterranean group of peoples, and they look very similar to anyone from Southern Europe, the Middle East and most North Africans. The Mediterraneum (and not Galia) it was the center of the Ancient civilizations and people were light brown skin all the way down. The whites -the Germanics- were barbarians in those times, and it seem some still are.

Moors were people of Morroco, Arabs and Europeans. The largest majority of them look quite the same to Southern Europeans. There were some other races like some Blacks, Gypsies (Indians) and also Slavic people, but they were less than the 1% of the Moors.

That idea that Portugueses are Black Africans is Germanic crap. Not because Blacks are inferior at all, but because it is not true that Black influence in genetic and culture has been so powerful in Portugal itself at all. The Genetics of the Mediterranean peoples is different from the Germanics since ancient times. Thanks God !

Actually, today we can see more Blacks in France, Great Britain and Canada that the numbers Portugal ever have.

This Canadian fellow should look at its own country as well. A place with so many East Asian people that the federal government is planning to change the name of the country from Canada to CHINADA.

And I can also distinguish the face of a Canadian at once. Perhaps is not really a smart look which calls the attention.

Regards,

Omar Vega

...
written by Guest, 2005-11-20 14:23:04

I'm an american that grew up next to the canadian border and I too can distinguish a white canadian from a white american about 90% of the time. So I guess using the logic of the canadian idiot, almost all canadian whites are not really white because I could "tell right away" that they are not american. Come to think of it I can usally tell a german, a russian, and italian for sure a frenchy also, so I guess none of them should be considered white either using the standard he implies. In fact probably only americans should be considered white, because I can't "tell right away" what ethnicity they are.

Re: guy from Norway
written by Guest, 2005-11-20 14:37:33

Are you from Norway or from Germany? Last time I checked the Germans started 2 world wars. But I guess you are saying that all white people should be to blame. I guess you have a lot of whitey guilt. Do you actually believe "white" people invented racism. You don't think people in africa thought and still think of other tribes as inferior. You don't think the Indians of a higher caste think of themselves as superior to people of a lower caste with darker skin. It's human nature to think you a culturally superior to others. It may be bulls**t but most people from what ever goup they feel a link to, be it racial or cultural feel the way they look and act is the "correct" way. As far as being white, why should a brazilian white person forget he is white any more than you should forget you are. Because there is a chance in the past that they might have some indian or black blood? And if they don't like the millions of descendents of italians, germans and others who immigrated to Brazil within the past century and a half, do they have your permission to be considered white? You are from Norway perhaps you have a drop of laplander blood, wouldn't that be great for you, you could stop feeling so guilty.

Brazil: Splitting into Two Races
written by Guest, 2005-12-15 08:06:19

here's how you have to read this.

Splitting 1: Horse race. (it's a race right?)

Splitting 3. Politician race: ALL of them racing after the MONEY.

There you go. These are the two RACES I know of in Brazil.

By the way, There is no race because we humans are a race. Think about this.
The martians are another race.

To 20year old Canadian guy
written by Guest, 2006-01-04 17:26:24

from "Northern View".

Only now I saw your answer, because I don't like this site and found it by chance.

But I suggest you to re-read my comment carefully before writing crap. Your knowledge of history and of Brazil is just embarassing. And your definitions of "races" (portugueses are not whites) only shows how racist you are.

You must be that upset because you do not look white in a society where this is very high-valued (this being subjective, since Canada is not famous for its beaches, canadians must be very very white), therefore you have an inferiority complex.

My comments on latin were just to show how stupid this whole labeling thing of "Hispanics" is. People don't even know that the word hispanic come from latin and refer to south american as a whole out of plain ignorance. When we have lots of peoples of several origins living here.

Your comments of what I am and I am not were really pathetic. I live since I was a kid in an environment (I mean family, not TV) where I could get influence from all kinds of culture, and I guess this is routine for lots of kids from Brazil, and as a result for not a second I stop to think what race a person is in my daily life. A act naturally and do VERY well in life without such notion, and my victories

You are only 20. The greatest victory you had was inviting that girl out in a date. You don't know what's victory you spoiled brat.

This not only led me to some funny situations, like hearing a "not-so-used to diversity" person speaking of "courage" when he saw a married black man and white woman on street and I just took a long time to figure out what he was talking about, .but also to great self-confidence.

And I really believe that we in Brazil are ahead of all of you in terms of "race notions", your limited northern view is just too poor.

Jamaican Lawyer
written by Guest, 2006-01-11 08:53:41

I have read alot about Brazil and recognise alot of parallels in our history. Jamaica also has the residue of slavery in the form of a lack of appreciation of our racial mix which is often characterised by a preference for individuals with lesser melanin than those an abundance of it. Only proper education about our past can create an appreciation of the uniqueness of our melting pot of races!

Will governments in countries like Brazil and Jamaica ever make that investment? The returns would be overwhelmingly empowering!

...
written by Guest, 2006-01-13 08:37:50

:zzz

Oops not racist...
written by Guest, 2006-02-16 08:26:48

The problem in Brazil is not a racial because people think black people are inferior...that is pretty impossible since people can trace back they origins to at least one negro ancestor.

The problem is SOCIAL, poor and rich, thats the real prejudice.

After the end of slavery the negroes were simply let go, not back to africa, but to ghetto, because none would pay for a former slave, and also many immigrants from Italy and Japan and other places came, they had agricultural techniques who were best fit for being paid.

So in about 500 years ( a short lifespan for a country) the once prejudice victims, the negroes, became the poor.

When I say its not a matter of color but of historical scope its not that every negro is treated without racial prejudice, but what I mean is that MOST, really the great majority of problems are not due to race but to social status.

That is very different you know why? Because when a rich negro woman or man goes shopping they are well treated and when a poor white woman or man goes they are treated bad.

This "Brazil has color prejudice"thing is a big virus in order to separate people, a real bogus story, trying to explain wrongly to negroes why they are treated this way and fomenting racial bias wher there is practically none.

...
written by Guest, 2006-02-19 16:50:51

I agree that in brazil racism by which blood purity is taken into account is less than say in the US. But negros are treated different and are for the most part assumed to be poor. Although I do think people do associate blacks negatively with crime, poverty and what not. Brazil does have racism, but you do make a valid point that it may mostly have to do with poverty. Although in Louisiana in the US many of the white people have black ancestors and racism is still very prevelant. This may may have to do with the anglo american puritan infuence after it was taken over by the US, after starting out as a much more racially relaxed place under the french, when most of the racial mixing occured.

Reply to: Oops not racist
written by Guest, 2006-02-24 09:04:13

I don't know what planet you live on, but if you think that colour pejudice is a fiction in Brazil you must be on drugs or something. I'm English (you know, Teutonic blood, paper-white skin, green eyes etc., that stuff the all the blacks who write on this site simply hate so much..) and ever since I came here to work, some ten years ago, I've found colour/race prejudice rampent. Some small examples: people tell me all the time that the south is better than Sao Paulo and the north of Brazil because there aren't any negros there. And when I was buying an appartment friends made useful suggestions as to good areas "Moema, Itaim, Jardines are all good, but Hiegionopolis is for the Jews'.

As for the poster who commented "Europeans aren't exatly xenophobic" , you're another who wants to get a grip. I'm assuming you really mean racist by this statement. Try travelling around Germany, Austria, Britain, Scandinavia, France, Spain etc. with a black face and you'll notice that the temperature of your reception will be far below welcoming point. Northern View was right in his comments about the Portugues too. Of course there is a reason for all this: coloured races simply don't belong in Europe in such numbers. It's as plain and simple as that. But in so-called 'melting-pot' cultures like Brazil peolpe point the finger......?

JewRIcan
written by Guest, 2006-03-10 08:33:39

The level of discourse here is appalling! This 20 year old Canadian’s notion of education is a joke, as are his pathetic pretensions to any kind of racial knowledge (Poor spelling and diseased English we should forgive.)

News Flash #1) Race does not exist in Science! The genetics of human populations are just too complex to support the popular notion of race.

News Flash #2) People everywhere on earth are aware of differences in appearance between themselves and other peoples! A stereotyping is almost inevitable, based on color (what people usually refer to when they say ‘race’), religion, language or whatever. I spent my childhood in Puerto Rico, where the dividing line was based mainly on hair texture (Buen pelo versus pelo malo.)

News Flash #3) Brazilians are people too! Plenty of stereotyping exists there as elsewhere, but in much of the country, more mixing occurs than was traditional in North America (that is changing there, though) as well as much more white poverty. Both these things dull the 'racial' divide. Brazilians are also more exacting in their color divisions than the North Americans - a mulatto Brazilian will not like being referred to as black, whereas in the USA or Canada people with only a tinge of black evident often refer to themselves as black.

New Flash #4) There are rich black and mulatto Brazilians! They can spend their money anywhere that white people can in Brazil - just like the in USA, Canada or western Europe.

Another thing that people should know is that southern Brazil, while heavily white, has plenty of black and Asian residents and visitors both. Stereotyping will exist there as well - my wife is from Florianópolis and I've been there often - if you are white and don't look Brazilian people assume you are from Argentina!

To JewRIcan
written by Guest, 2006-03-21 08:53:19

Why do any foreigner that is married to a brazilian thinks at know EVERYTHING about Brazil?

There's a big chance that the woman married to you was trying to get a ticket to the 1st World. The same way if I went to forgotten place in the country and tell I'm from Sao Paulo lots of girls will jump on me just for me "to take them to Sao Paulo".

To your #2, that may sound right but it's not. People here are not segregated like in US, Canada or Europe.

There color is a BIG ISSUE there, so much everyone knows right away what "they are" (what they were told to be). But there's no integration beyond politically correct talk.

Here is different. How so? Here is pretty easy to see marriage between people of different origins and that's not seen as something even noteworthy.

There are several customs of African origins that are openly practiced and guess what, my blue eyed grandparent used to practice some in the past! SUCH INTEGRATION IS IMPOSSIBLE IN US, CANADA AND EUROPE.

If I have to bet I'd say Brazil as people has a future, you don't. You'll never move beyond your segregated society because:

- Europeans are cristalized, there's too much "tradition" for leaving the "white" idea behind;

- US could be different but it's not, because who lives there, even the black ones, believe the actual state of things (living separated) is "the right thing".

You can't just put a bunch of people together and believe that makes a "multicultural society".

Your #3 is SIMPLY pathethic. Brazilians do get mad if are called Hispanics or Black because they aren't Hispanics and they aren't Black.

MANY OF US have indians anscestors, white anscestors or asians. What makes you think they should accept the label "Black"? As far as I know, myself included, I wouldn't like to be called neither black, neither indian and neither white because I'm NONE OF THOSE.

Re: \"Reply to: Oops not racist\"
written by Guest, 2006-03-21 09:07:04

I find it funny when gringos come here and see racism. If you're not saying pollitically correct talk every 5 minutes then you are racist.

Only because just don't care it doesn't mean they are racist.

Brazilians are so more relaxed that your society and your very well divided line of "what's what looks" is RACIST. Why someone need to specific terminology to every living thing if it's not for dividing it?

I bet if we give people the proper education and the proper clothing and they will be well received anywhere in this country. At least the probability of being not welcome will be far smaller than in Europe.

The issue here is not color, it's poverty. No one likes poor people, for obvious reasons. Fix that and your "racism" is gone.

re: tojewrican
written by Guest, 2006-03-22 21:04:09

That is funny I lived in Brazil for 3 years and never met a black brazilian who didn't know they were black. Or a white brazilian who didn't call themselves white. Of course there are a lot of people in the middle, but even the lighter skin mulattos I know will refer to themselves as being partly black and know that they are not completely exepted by higher society. Other than that I agree with your main point about europe and the US being much more segregated.

...
written by Guest, 2006-03-23 14:14:17

I think you are 100% wrong. I live here for all my life an I saw people that didn't know that they were black or another thing.

THIS IS NOT AN ISSUE HERE. Ok, if you go to one of those small colonies of german or dutch people in the south, or japanese or chinese in Sao Paulo you'll see it, but because they are HOMOGENEOUS. A bunch of people that look a like, but that doesn't reflect the ENTIRE COUNTRY.

Gringos think they know too much. For once just try to learn a little instead of just start spitting out these stupid things.

I am "mulatto" (per gringo definition), and I am 100% accepted. I don't consider myself to be black because I don't look like one, nor white, nor anything else because my family is full of all kinds of people.

It happened that I had blonde girlfriends and NOT ONCE I felt any kind of "racism" by the part of their families!

I have worked in several places, smaller companies and bigger companies, and NOT ONCE I felt any kind of "racism". I worked in a company full of Japanese-descendent people (it was a japanese firm) and still NO RACISM.

But why? Because I'm not a starving poor man! I'm not rich though, but I don't live in rags.

What people doesn't like here is poor people. And don't think that aren't white poors. Yes, there are!

This racism talk is pure "gringo vision". The only problem here is social.

I get really really mad when I here that "non-whites" (for not saying mulattos) are put down in this country, because I know by my life experience that it's not true! Now, I have relatives that prefer to go after woman instead of doing hard work, are they poor because of their choices or because there's racism?

A gringo would probably pick the second option, because they CAN'T LIVE as ONE PEOPLE with others that are different. That tells a lot about the gringo, but not about Brazil.

above comment
written by Guest, 2006-03-27 17:51:51

Ok if you want ot give annectdotal evidence then how about this. The man that lives in front of my girlfriends house is a lighter skin mullato who lives in Rio de Janiero. He is married to a white woman from Minas. Her mother hates the fact that she married him, simply because he is part black. He is one of the nicest guys, relatively educated, and makes enough money to have two houses. Yet she doesn't like him because he is part black. So if you wants anectdotes there is one for you. I believe there is racism in brazil but it is less that in the US. And people to get along easier, but just because I am a gringo doesn't mean I can't validly observe what is going on. And being mullato per gringo defenition means nothing. It is how you are viewed in your own society that matters. And I still believe that there are families and people who are racist against people of color ini brazil. It is not as cut and dry as in the US or Europe (thank god)but is still there.

Re: above comment
written by Guest, 2006-03-29 08:52:30

I don't doubt of your story, but taking one case and using it for the entire country is no less stupid than label France as a land of a*****es only because a french guy you once met was an a*****e.

The same way Brazil is not a 100% a*****e free country, it's not a 100% racism free country.

But you will see far more integration here than anywhere else.

Saying, as many other posters said, that the mullatos are "not accepted" is "gringo vision" in action and nothing else. I have met lots of mullatos and blacks (per gringo definition) that are successful and either have relatives or are married to whites.

to dumbs**t from So Paulo
written by Guest, 2006-03-30 15:41:20

To the moron who wrote the following “There's a big chance that the woman married to you was trying to get a ticket to the 1st World. The same way if I went to forgotten place in the country and tell I'm from Sao Paulo lots of girls will jump on me just for me "to take them to Sao Paulo".

Your are evidently too stupid to know that a white physician (or any other affluent professional in any color) from Floripa can get a visa and come to USA without having to marry for it..

You are definitely too stupid to know that in English, Puerto Ricans are not Gringos, no matter what color they are. I am used to walking into shops in Santa Catarina and having people speak to me in Spanish because of my blonde hair and blue eyes – they are obviously stereotyping and some are definitely attitudinal about it (till I respond in Portuguese with a clearly non-Argentinean accent) but they are just playing the odds, given all the tourists from the cone there, and they don’t mean to suck when they say it like you do.

Learn a few things before you open your sphincter to speak. If girls from the countryside would come to SP for you, you wouldn’t post this kind of idiocy – you must look like the north side of a southbound baboon. My Sympathies but ¡tu verga es brea!

Portuguese are part German
written by Guest, 2006-03-30 15:49:51

Omar Vega should remember that Germans (Visigoths, Vandals and Swabians) ruled Spain and Portugal from the fall of Roma to the advent of the Moors.

Those genes are still found in Brazilians of Iberian origin.

The average Latin American, Brazilians i
written by Guest, 2006-03-31 10:14:27

It seems that the ignorant f**ks posting here are not only unaware that just like in Latin America or Canada knowledge of other regions and countries is a function of social class as well of education, and plenty of Canadians and Latin Americans know jack s**t about the outside world. My favorite Latin American exchange was in Los Angeles,